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Boeing’s Contract Win Dirty Politics?

Tanya Sinkovits

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ST. LOUIS, Mo. (KMOX) — Boeing workers across the United States are celebrating their big win today, but some analysts can’t help but question, why Boeing? The long thought underdog took the $35 billion deal Thursday from previous contract winner European Aeronautic Defence.

“I got to tell you, I was surprised as well,” said Bloomberg Television’s Chief Washington Correspondent Peter Cook. “EADS was certainly talking as if they won this contract and Boeing, for the most part looked like they were getting ready to protest.”

Deputy Defense Secretary William Lynn insists “Boeing was a clear winner.”

However lawmakers in Alabama, a state that would have benefited from an EADS contract win, blame the change in mood to politics.

“I’m disappointed but not surprised,” Republican Sen. Richard Shelby said. “Only Chicago politics could tip the scales in favor of Boeing’s inferior plane. EADS clearly offers the more capable aircraft.”

Republican Rep. Jo Bonner has vowed to get a full accounting of why the EADS bid was rejected.

The contract to replace the half-century-old KC-135 tanker fleet has been closely fought over for nearly ten years.

The losing bidder can appeal.

Listen Below:
Full interview with Peter Cook

——————————————————————————–

Previous Story:

SEATTLE (AP) — Washington state and Kansas are celebrating a decision to award Boeing Co. a $35 billion contract to build nearly 200 airborne refueling tankers, one of the biggest defense contracts ever that will add tens of thousands of jobs to the struggling economy and bolster regional air industries for a generation.

But Thursday’s announcement that the Air Force chose Chicago-based Boeing over a bid by European Aeronautic Defence and Space Co. drew deeply disappointing reactions in Europe, where the aircraft manufacturer promised to discuss the decision with the U.S. military.

It also came as a severe setback to the Gulf Coast and to Alabama, where EADS had planned to assemble its aircraft at a former military base in Mobile.

The contract to replace the half-century-old KC-135 tanker fleet is a major boost for the Puget Sound region and Wichita, Kan., where the planes will be built and modified.

But it came as a surprise to many after defense analysts, politicians, factory workers and even company executives had expected EADS to win the decade-long battle with Boeing, which had been marked by delays, missteps and bitter accusations.

So expecting the worst, there were no big rallies were planned in Washington state and union halls quiet on a day when snow buried much of the state.

Boeing machinist Jason Redrup was riding with friends in his car when he heard Rep. Norm Dicks, D-Wash., say Boeing had won.

“Frankly, I didn’t believe it when he said it,” Redrup said, adding that a companion told him, “Well, we better wait until we hear from the Air Force.”

At Boeing’s huge Everett factory where the planes are built, workers who had gathered around TVs and computer screens shook hands and high-fived at the news, said worker Steve Morrison.

“You could hear little blocks of cheers throughout the factory,” he said. Outside, car horns blared during a shift change.

“I’m going to celebrate with my wife tonight,” said Rashaud Emperado, a 767 inspector, adding: “I will be celebrating this weekend. This is not just one day.”

Air Force Secretary Michael Donley said the contract “represents a long overdue start to a much-needed program.”

“What we can tell you was that Boeing was a clear winner,” Deputy Defense Secretary William Lynn said.

Lynn said the losing bidder can appeal, but he believes the process was fair and there will be no grounds for a protest.

EADS said in a statement Friday that it would go over the issue with the Air Force, but said nothing about a formal appeal.

“This is certainly a disappointing turn of events, and we look forward to discussing with the Air Force how it arrived at this conclusion,” EADS North America Chairman Ralph D. Crosby, Jr. said.

The company said it was sending a letter to its employees explaining that the decision does not mean the end of EADS’ efforts to expand in the United States.

German Foreign Minister Raider Bruederle said “we assume that the decision will now be analyzed closely by EADS North America and its American partners and that possible further steps and consequences will be considered in that.” Bruederle did not elaborate.

Lawmakers from Alabama were bitter and suggested politics played a role.

“I’m disappointed but not surprised,” Republican Sen. Richard Shelby said. “Only Chicago politics could tip the scales in favor of Boeing’s inferior plane. EADS clearly offers the more capable aircraft.”

Republican Rep. Jo Bonner vowed to get a full accounting of why the EADS bid was rejected.

“This competition has been challenged before and it’s not unlikely it will be challenged again,” Bonner said.

The tankers, basically flying gas stations, are crucial for the military, allowing jet fighters, supply planes and other aircraft to cover long distances. The last Boeing-built KC-135 was delivered in 1965, and the Air Force is struggling to keep them in flying shape.

Boeing has built 767-based tankers for Italy and Japan, but many components will be different in the U.S. version. As a result, production and the plane’s first flight are not expected until 2015, said Jean Chamberlin, vice president and general manager of the tanker program.

Pentagon leaders said Boeing and EADS met all the mandatory requirements for the contract. Because the difference in price between the two bids was greater than 1 percent of the total, cost essentially was the deciding factor.

Dennis Muilenburg, president and CEO of Boeing’s defense business, declined to say how much Boeing cut its anticipated profits with its final offer.

“Clearly we’ve been focused on affordability,” he said, adding that Boeing will be able to make the plane more cheaply because it will use the same production line as its civilian version.

The award gives Boeing the initial $3.5 billion for engineering, manufacturing and development of the first four aircraft, with 18 planes to be delivered to the Air Force by 2017. The $35 billion contract for 179 planes could be a first installment on a $100 billion deal if the Air Force decides to buy more.

Boeing will have to move fast to get the plane ready, at a time when its commercial aircraft division is still trying to deliver the new 787 and a new version of the 747. The company is completing a new 767 assembly line in Everett to provide more room to make the long-delayed 787, but also in hopes of a contract win.

Boeing has 49 unfilled orders for 767s, the initial versions of which first flew in the early 1980s, and plans to be making two planes a month later this year.

The contract will support about 50,000 total U.S. jobs with Boeing and some 800 suppliers in more than 40 states, the company says. For Washington state alone, Boeing has said it would mean 11,000 jobs and $693 million in annual economic benefits.

It will bring 7,500 new jobs and an estimated $388 million to Kansas “at a time when the aviation industry and our nation needs them the most,” said Sen. Pat Roberts, R-Kan.

“I’m in the middle of a blizzard but it’s all blue skies,” he said.

“This is good for America. This is good for our community. What more can we ask for?” said Wichita Mayor Carl Brewer, a former Boeing engineer.

Dicks called Thursday “the happiest day of my professional life.”

Union leaders said the contract will mean long-term stability for aircraft workers. Redrup said it also means older workers will be able to pass along critical skills to a new generation. That knowledge, he said, “gives us a huge advantage.”

Over the years, efforts to award the contract have been thwarted by Pentagon bungling and the criminal conviction of a top Defense Department official.

The Air Force at first planned to lease and buy Boeing planes for tankers, but that fell through. It later awarded a contract to Northrop Grumman Corp. and EADS, but in 2008 the Government Accountability Office upheld Boeing’s protest.

The Air Force reopened bidding last year, only to be embarrassed again as it mistakenly gave Boeing and EADS sensitive information that contained each other’s confidential bids.

Boeing promoted its “American-made” tanker, though both companies had planned to build their planes in the United States.

EADS, which bases its tanker on its Airbus A330 passenger jet, has 11 of its tankers in production and 28 more on order for countries including Australia and Britain.

The two companies have bickered over whether they received unfair subsidies from the governments in their home countries. Last month, the European Union said the World Trade Organization found U.S. aid to Boeing Co. violated international rules. Last year, the WTO ruled that trade rules were broken by Europe’s “launch aid” to Airbus, including virtually risk-free loans as well as other support.

Boeing’s share price jumped $2.44, or about 2.5 percent, to $73.20 on the news.

___

Associated Press writers Donna Cassata, Lolita C. Baldor, Chris Rugaber and Ben Evans in Washington, D.C., Bob Johnson in Mobile, Ala., Josh Freed in Minneapolis, Roxana Hegeman in Wichita, Kan., and Molly Rosbach in Olympia, Wash. contributed to this report.

Copyright 2011 The Associated Press

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  • http://www.soi.city.ac.uk/~cs379/wpblog/wordpress/?p=184 Today’s Links February 25, 2011 | Information Architecture Blog

    [...] Europe to Losing US Tanker ContractNew York TimesEU Dismayed at Boeing DecisionWall Street JournalKMOX.com -Bellingham Herald -Kansas City Starall 2,365 news [...]

  • William

    Good to keep a tech base going, but will Boeing unveil hidden costs as pass-alongs half-way through the production run? I’m a tad suspicious, but at least the planes will be ours, and not subject to the delivery whims of the feckless European Union—say, a gov’t that supplies a critical part to the Us factories objects to a U.S. war and cuts the supply. At least that’s not now an issue.

  • james A

    Chicago politics from those who own the White House

  • ralph

    Tough….Boeing won, stop whinning. If you idiots had won, not a word have been
    said — dem0000crats as usual.

  • DirtyPolitics

    Let’s see … the 767 has 65% of it’s component parts built by off-shore companies. So stop playing the “Buy USA” game. The A330 is a superior airframe, Boeing cannot keep a schedule if it tried, and yes, Boeing will add cost-overruns. What a joke of a political decision.

  • Lois Flowers

    EADS is non-union. They would have been built in Alabama by American Workers.. just not the ones recognized by the Democratic Party. I guess we should cut t hem some slack. Our President needed this desparately for 2012 funds… Union and Dems. You research this bidding war, and you’ll see its been dirty from the beginning. Not whining.. just telling the truth. Sad sad days in the USA.

  • NVRAT

    So what Keep American job in America. If someone does not like it they can go pound sand and pick their nose.

  • sam

    The Air Force would have had to have built larger hangers, flight aprons, and runways in order to accommodate the A330′s “superior airframe” so cost was deciding factor. And any cost overruns would be taken by Boeing, just as EADS would’ve had to they they won. Facts hurt, huh?

  • Damocles

    It’s interesting that Boeing was only 1% under the price shown for EADS. The local paper here in Seattle said, that the 1% diffference offset ‘all of the other benefits that EADS had over Boeing.” Let’s you know that all the quality issues were EADS.

    Also – Jim McDermott (D) was on the committee with great influence during the selection process, and he is known as an incredibly dirty politician here, to say nothing of the two Senators Cantwell and Murray (both D’s of course).

    Cirty Politics? You betcha!!

  • NVRAT

    Besides Boeing has a proven work record. I know because I have worked with them in the past as a sub contractor. Too hell with EADS. Our military should be supported by an American company regardless of union people or not…unions I have no use for them never have but, I do believe in American manufacturers.

  • Damocles

    NVRAT – I live less than a mile from the 737 plant in Seattle area, and to the union slime here, they acknowledge in the local drinking holes after work that their product can’t stay on schedule and that the quality isn’t anything like it was 20 years ago. Plus the 767 was scheduled to shut down because the airframe really suxs to high heaven (oops, can I use that word on CBS website?).

  • Grendel

    And isn’t it funny that the Air Force ‘accidentally’ sent the EADS bid information to Boeing back in November…Just a computer glitch, I’m sure.

  • Grendel

    But, if you’ll recall. EADS DID win the initial bid process. But Obama put in his two cents worth (who’s National Security Advisor came from Boeing Board of Directors), and it was decicded that only Boeing could win.

    Just a few other facts you might not know: EADS has a flying aircrat and refueling boom, Boeing does not. Boeing made a big deal of 40% of aircraft components would be foriegn supplied in the EADS aircraft, while neglecting to mention that 65% of their own aircraft parts would be. Boeing is years behind in supplying other contracts. And that ‘cotton field in Alabama’ where the EADS aircraft would be manufactured is actually Brookley Field, which is a former Air Base that one of the most logistically viable air fields the US ever had.

  • Grendel

    What? You don’t consider Mobile, Alabama as part of America? (Don’t worry, Obama doesn’t either.)

  • Grendel

    Yes, Boeing has a proven work record. They have proven that they can not deliver a functioning airplane on time or fullfill contracts. The Dreamliner was supposed to be in service in 2008, and they still don’t know when they’ll be flying.

  • TSC

    It’s “whose”, not “who’s”.

  • TSC

    Should be “its”, not “it’s”.

  • Ken Martin

    I am from Alabama and I am glad that Boeing won. The politicians are telling the people of Alabama that the Airbus tanker will be built in Alabama, that is totally false. Airbus would fly green aircraft to Mobile and do a tanker conversion and add the military avionics, The long term cost for the Airbus would be rediculous, because the repairs would have to be done by European OEM’s such as Thales, Diehl and Liebherr Technik, OEM’s that have restricted access to data to allow third party repairs of their equipment. Buying an Airbus is like buying an HP printer, the printers are cheap but the get you on the printer cartridges. I’d rather see 20,000 jobs maintained in Seattle than to get 1,500 hundred in Mobile for what it would cost the taxpayers.

  • LibsAreCommies

    It should be law that all US Military contracting be done by American companies. Period. Keep the jobs and the money here at home.

  • Steve Daniel Sr.

    How can they do that when they sub out 65% of the work to foreign companies?

  • donm

    No, AF doesn’t need larger hangers. These aircraft are outdoors almost always. The few paint hangers needed are already available. They all land on the same runways.

  • Sorely Frickey

    It’s disgusting they didn’t give this contract to Europe. Socialists need jobs, too!

  • Joel D. Leek

    I just checked and yes, it still says ‘America’ on the door to this country. Who and why would anyone debate the building of US Military aircraft in the US by a US company? The disease Liberalitis must be be a glory to be afflickted with. I just don’t see it.

  • SickOfTheFighting

    And the initial bid process was all-but deemed as rigged for EADS in the first place – and that was before Obama was even a blip on the political radar.

    “Years behind in supplying other contracts.” Really? Do tell. Which contracts? Which parts? Preferably by delivery order and promise date. Have that info? Didn’t think so. Put your big boy pants on and go cry a river for EADS.

    The reality here is that no one here, at this news organization, or even in this thread, has the slightest clue about the “realities” behind this entire process. For anyone here to claim “ah, it was just dirty politics” is absurdly and embarrassingly naive. If all it took were “dirty politicians,” why couldn’t they just have just waved their evil magic wand five years ago and made all this go away?

    The point is its a process more complicated than anyone here can possibly understand, one that has been fraught with curious behavior on both sides. Its time for baseless, one-sided idiocy like that of Grendel to go by the wayside and move forward.

  • SickOfTheFighting

    Dirty,

    You have no clue what you’re talking about. None.

  • Nick

    I can’t understand either the whining about an American company getting a jet contract which is one in many what thousands issued to this company proven to be a great investment over the decades?

    I don’t get it either along with others here. Any jobs going to an American nowadays one would think would be something liberals could be happy about. Especially since Obama burned through trillions to all his buddies and about 40,ooo jobs have come from it..all in the socialist Obama government.

    The country goes to shiiiiite they (liberals) cheer and prosper, when it gets better they flounder, what does that say about these people?

  • roofie

    Chicago’s biggest industry and largest export is:

    Corrupt politicians.

  • Dave

    donM,

    the A330 has a larger footprint–fewer will fit in a given area of ramp and fewer in large hangers for maintenance Work. If they can even get the larger 330 in the door.

    A330 requires longer runway and wider taxiway, reducing number of fields they can use. larger fuel load doesn’t help if tanker won’t land with other planes on a ferry mission and has to divert to a larger field elsewhere.

    a330 fly by wire and computer controlled throttle will make it easier to maintain a racetrack course, but if the s___ hits the fan and the tanker needs to move quickly, will the pilot be able to do the avoidance maneuver as well as a 767?

    Longevity is another issue. in the ’60s, no one would have guessed that 135s would still be flying in the 2010′s. 767 with aluminum construction will be equally durable. airbus airframes are not known for durability and ease of repair.

    the arguments go on without end…just acquire the birds and get them in the air!!!

  • Hedley Lamar

    This bid should have never left the US. We have Boeing B-52′s and tankers that are still flying reliably after a half a century. What else do you need to know? These are warcraft, not commercial passenger planes. They need to be built by US companies. Period. Not only that, but the EADS planes are subsidized by their government making their “bid” questionable. PLUS, they were too big and couldn’t land on tactical airfields. This is a no-contest decision except for the people in Alabama who want the work.

  • hempstead1944

    Yep…Boeing won the same way General Motors did…..political clout…..union thugs doing what they do best….buy off politicians….the New America !

  • jackolantyrn356

    Everything inviolved with Obama is sleezy and dirty. Being Presidetn even if a fake President csan make a gangster anything more than a Theif. ….. Unlike all the exciting movies A theif is always exactly that. No romance to it. Just Liberal Horse Manure.
    And if one of threse air buggys falls then it will be “All my Sons” all ob=ver again.

  • Grendel

    For SickOfTheFighting:

    No, the INITIAL bid process was halted due to Boeing bribing the Selection Board Members with high-paid positions in Boeing.

    The first COMPLETED bid process was won by Northrop Grumman/EADS. It was awarded while Obama was running for President. He commented on how he thought Boeing should win the contract. Boeing filed a complaint where their argument was basically, “Hey, you can’t count the fact the their airplane is better than ours against us.” Strangely enough, after he become President and hires a Boeing Executive as National Security Advisor, they do win.

    Explain why, after EADS wins and Boeing appeals, the entire process is halted until appeals can be heard. BUT, it was stated during the announcement that, in the event of an EADS appeal, the contract and process would go on.

    And the Dreamline is currently over THREE YEARS behind schedule. Its CONTRACT delivery date with All Nippon Airways is now over a year behind.

    It was obvious during the announcment that even the board was not even making an attempt to pretend that the contract was not handed to Boeing by the administration.

  • Der Stig

    The planes and spare parts will be OURS and the money to build them will not go to help the European countries which subsidize SCAREBUS to the tune of billions, to help them in later attempts to criipple Boeing. Just follow the NEWS, the bleepin BRITS won’t buy the best attack helos in the WORLD because THEY don’t build them, we do. BUT we’re supposed to buy their lousy cobbeled up tankers. HOW LONG has Boeing been building good airframes for the US defence? Decades. Remember when the FRENCH wouldn’t let our F 111′s fly across FRANCE when we went after Momo??? Bellp them and their grovern=ment aircraft industry. BUY American made!!! BOEING built the B 17 AND the B 29. Has Scarebus ever built a military aircraft?

  • ldenton

    If you think that Boeing builds all of its aircraft here in America, then I have some nice oceanfront property in Florida to sell you. Get your facts right. 65% of Boeing aircraft is built overseas. I think, bottom line, the best plane should have gotten the contract. That did not happen. I live in Mobile, and we have been fighting this battle for 10 years. If you want to know what happened, here it is: First, Alabama voted Republican the last two elections. Second, Alabama is a right to work state – we don’t kowtow to unions like the state of Washington does. Who paid for Obama to be elected? Unions.

  • George

    Who is going to be the Engine supplier for this Boeing tanker???

  • lukuj

    Other cities are not known for their corruption anywhere near as much as Chicago,so it is logical that other places would complain since chances are good their was some corruption involved. I’m not surprised Alabama didn’t get the contract. It is in the South and a basically red state, both of which Obama doesn’t like. Seattle, however, is liberal and blue – but of course the president is from Chicago.

  • Opaobie

    The Boeing Company’s Defense, Space & Security facility in Wichita, Kansas, which includes a huge modification and delivery center, has been the primary development, modification, testing, and delivery center for not only the new KC-767 tankers being delivered to the Japanese and Italian Air Forces but does extensive modification and testing for the VC-25A (aka Air Force One), the C-32A, the C-40B/C, the Navy’s C-40A and E-6B, the E-4B…not to mention the B-52, KC-135, and B-1 work they complete, AWACS, ABL,…. It is also collocated with the massive Spirit AeroSystems plant, which was originally all Boeing’s, so the infrastructure for the new Air Force Tanker has been in place for decades…along with the expertise in aerial refueling technology and proven design and delivery that dates back to B-29 days. What exactly did EADS offer that compares with Boeing?

  • Opaobie
  • Hank Warren

    Endless corruption, yet another violation of our rights. Add it to the list of gov’t violations of our right:
    They violate the 1st Amendment by placing protesters in cages, banning books like “America Deceived II” and censoring the internet.
    They violate the 2nd Amendment by confiscating guns.
    They violate the 4th and 5th Amendment by molesting airline passengers.
    They violate the entire Constitution by starting undeclared wars for foreign countries.
    Impeach Obama and sweep out the Congress.
    (Last link of Banned Book):
    http://www.iuniverse.com/Bookstore/BookDetail.aspx?BookId=SKU-000190526

  • Carl

    You don’t suppose the fact that the EADS built airplane dropped its refueling boom in the ocean during a test flight would be a mark against EADS and a mark in Boeings favor do you?

  • Mike

    Why would there be hidden costs that EADS would not have building a larger plane? The other question is, why would we need a fleet of almost 200 oversize planes to replace the existing KC-135 fleet? Does not fully makes sense.

    The Airbus 300 is intriguing for its heavy airlift capacity. But not up to 200 planes? We also have about 60 high capacity KC-10 tankers based on the DC-10 airframe in service right now. For the moment, the Airbus 330 based tanker is a white elephant right from the start. Only politics could ever had made it into an alternative.

  • Tony P

    You’re a states man, man Martin for president!

  • afraid4me

    Keep whining, St. Louis. Your population keeps dropping, and your labor unions are ruining your job base. We give the contract to an American based company and you complain. Get over it.
    I used to live in Missouri, but got out many years ago. St. Louis and Kansas City are both decaying cities being ruined by labor unions and racial politics in the schools.

  • Algae

    And when Boeing starts hurting because they had to bid under the profit margin then the taxpayers can bail them out. It’s more of the same leftist liberal “wealth distribution” scam.

    Unlike the days of the SST where the company took the gamble, lost and went on, a business these days only has to suck up to (i.e. pay off) the leftist liberals in government knowing they will be fully insulated from loss by the taxpayers. And.. with the B0 admin’s handy DOJ puppets none of this corruption will ever see the light of day either.

  • John Merchlinski

    Built in the USA is all I care about.

  • Opaobie

    Nonsense. The proposal all along has called for replacing a ’57 station wagon, Boeing offered an SUV, and EADS offered an 18-wheeler. The Boeing offering met the requirements; the EADS offering didn’t.

  • Opaobie

    You have Boeing and EADS reversed. EADS is heavily subsidize by the EU; Boeing is a publicly traded company that has to earn a profit or go broke. The taxpayers are not obligated to “bail out” Boeing.

  • Mike

    How can EADS sell a much larger plane, 275,000 pounds versus 180,000 pounds for the same price without illegal subisdies?

    The Western Europeans are our allies and NATO partners. I think think anyone should object to buying some their planes for use as an intermediate tanker and heavy lift platform. But replacing the whole fleet with the A330? Are you #@#&?

    Is anyone actually looking at the specifications of these airplanes? It’s all available in wikipedia and other military and aviation websites

  • chukalukabus

    All these planes regardless of contractor were to be built in the USA. It is in the contract. The ONLY difference between between the two companys is that Boeing is 100% union labor. EADS, not so much.

    Which brings us to the source of the problem: Obama.

    Virtually every single penny of the trillions this moron has blown in bailouts, stimulus, and TARP has ended up in one of two places 1) Unions 2) Crony capitalist on Wall Street.

    EADS was by far the better choice. To say this is political is only to point out the obvioius.

  • Opaobie

    Apparently you have an Obama-obsession; everything has to be tied to Obama or whatever. EADS would have built the airplanes in Europe, not the USA, and MAYBE 1500 jobs finishing the modification would have occurred in Alabama…unless EADS decided to farm that out to a European subcontractor. many of Boeing’s facilities are in “Right to Work” states, including Kansas, where much of the new tanker work will occur. The award to Boeing will provide more than 50,000 American jobs, and it will deliver the airplane the Air Force has been trying to procure for more than a decade.

  • Jack Hughes

    Let’s see…Rahm recently reported making $18.5 mil a couple of years ago and Bill Daley reported making $20 mil last year… Two untalented guys whose only worth is access to corrupt politicians!!!

  • China

    I no problem with boeing getting the contract..My company will get at least 456 million in the first 4 years and every one of my 62,546 Chinese workers will be thanking America every day for awarded contract.
    BTW: Any other offshore companies/workers happy about this contract? Please comment.
    BTW: Federal Build in America act requires 51% produced in America, and if the contract is over 9 million a NAFTA signatory country can come onboard. Otherwise the :COTS” act applies. Boeing meets none of these standards.
    LOLOLOLOL

  • IAmTheManThatArrangesTheBlocks

    The Communist Broadcasting System objects to the use of the bourgeois religious term “heaven”.

    Please do not do that again.

  • Ed Quigtey

    About damn time that the politicians did something right for the US! Our people get paid, our people keep the profits. . . I guess the people fussing about this decision have OTHER priorities!

  • ThommyL

    What’s not being said is that Boeing imports parts/assemblies from communist countries such as Red China! At least EADS would have been a NATO program.
    Taxpayers: Get ready for schedule slips and cost overruns. Look at the history of the first tankers sold by Boeing to Italy and Japan..WAY behind schedule! And excessive time to get certified to even fly. But I guess that’s a union thing. The longer the schedule, the more hours worked, and more cost overruns that we all pay for……..well most of us anyway. The politicians involved I’m sure have their pockets full of Boeing money. Money talks, no matter what else is at stake. Unfortunately, the military is the real loser here.

  • Opaobie

    “Just a few other facts you might not know: EADS has a flying aircrat and refueling boom, Boeing does not.”

    Hogwash. Ever hear of the KC-135, flying since the 1950s or the KC-10 or the KC-767 currently being flown by both the Italian and Japanese Air Forces?, ALL Boeing aircraft. The Boeing Company created the aerial refueling technology beginning with a modified B-29. EADS has yet to succeed in coming close to what Boeing has been doing on a regular basis for more than 70 years. EADS refueling boom might work on submarines if they want to recover the one they dropped into the ocean on their flight test. If the U.S. government would create a more business-friendly environment, the stampede of companies returning to the USA would be breathtaking, and American subcontractors would spring up like daisies.. If you want to see a world class modification center, visit the Boeing site in Wichita, Kansas.

  • http://thedailyconservative.net/2011/02/26/chicagoland-lawmaker-suggests-boeings-contract-win-a-result-of-dirty-politics/ CHICAGOLAND: Lawmaker Suggests BOEING’S Contract Win A Result Of Dirty Politics… | The Daily Conservative

    [...] (First column, 12th story, link) [...]

  • Delta A&P

    Of the 874 aircraft currently in he French Air Force, 32 are American made. Yet proponnents of the EADS bid would have us purchase 5 1/2 times that many French aircraft for the American Air Force. When you consider other factors such as size, footprint, dissimiliar test and maintenance equipment, etc and the fact that Boeing has been building or maintaining USAF Tankers for over 50 years, I have no problem “understanding” the reasoning behind the decision. When you add to that the fact that the money paid to an American Company will stay in America, it does nothing to diminish the manufacturing base, and the very simple fact that Boeing builds better airplanes (I am an A&P Mechanic who has worked on both Boeing and EADS (Airbus) aircraft, the decision is easy.

  • Opaobie

    Nice argument for repealing all the nonsense, anti-business regulations imposed on America by Liberal Democrats and RINO Republicans over the past 60 years. We probably rank below Zimbabwe for “business-friendliness”.

  • John Connor

    If anyone would know crooked politics, it would be a Chicago politician!

  • Joe

    American tax dollars should go to American companies. Everything the government buys should be from American suppliers.

  • SeniorC

    take this from a retired military (22 years) that works on Boeing and Airbus aircrafts, Boeing planes are better and I am a concervative Republican.

  • typicalwhiteguy

    Dirty politics, you say? Sen. Shelby hit the nail on the head with that statement. but I don’t think he or very many others realize just how dirty.
    It’s not merely coincidence that Rahm Emmanuel was elected mayor on Tuesday in one of the most crooked elections ever; even for Chicago. Then the Boeing contract was awarded on Thursday.
    Rahm didn’t just up and decide to run for mayor out of pure political desire and ambition. Note how he “suddenly” announced his plans last fall just after the democrats suffered huge losses at all levels. They knew from the results that widespread public sentiment had turned against them and the road would be a lot tougher for them the next two years. They also knew that the sycophantic media might eventually turn somewhat against them as the economy continually worsens and the truth about their legislative “successes” is horrifyingly revealed; like Obamacare.
    Without the popular and media support they have enjoyed and an increasingly skeptical populace, more and more people might begin to question and demand more objective and investigative analysis of the regime. The regime, and Rahm and the Kenyan particularly, might come under much more scrutiny in the future; especially during the next Blago trial.
    In crooked Illinois politics, no one, not even the governor, wields more power and influence than the mayor of Chicago. That being said, the mayor would be in a unique position to influence the conduct of that trial. He would be able to twist arms, blackmail, or payoff cops, judges and lawyers to do certain things somewhat shady if not downright illegal to oh, maybe, suppress certain evidence or prevent certain key players in the scandal from being called to testify. Bottom line, the Kenyan needed his own trusted lieutenant in the mayor’s office to make sure that him and several others neck-deep in the criminal activity that took place in trying to sell (and buy) Obama’s senate seat would never have to incriminate themselves on a witness stand.
    Funny how the opportunity for Rahm, who did not even meet the residency requirements to run, suddenly presented itself when mayor Daley, of the crooked Daley dynasty, suddenly announced his decision not to run and was almost immediately offered a presidentially appointed position in D.C.
    For Rahm to win, it would take huge sums of money; much more than local politicians could shake down their constituents for and the union bosses in the machine’s hip pocket could generate.
    This left a golden opportunity for the Kenyan to basically bribe Chicago’s recently transplanted Boeing Co. to cover the spread in exchange for the lucrative tanker contract that was all but lost as their challenge of EADS had failed. The Kenyan also knew that any money remaining after the election would be laundered through Rahm and delivered to his 2012 reelection campaign.
    Just as with GM and the Wall Street criminals, Barack Obama, who publicly attacks and chastises corporate America to curry favor with the rank and file looters that elected him; turns to these same corporations with his hand out to extract “protection money” to advance his evil agenda.
    Remember, this is the same diabolical Kenyan that knew nothing of the dealings of his personal “sweetheart deal” realtor Tony Rezko, never heard the Rev. Jeremiah Wright spew his black liberation theology hatred despite sitting in the “amen” pew for 20 years and referred to Bill Ayers as “just a guy in the neighborhood” despite having launched his political career from Bill’s living room.

  • Marc Jeric

    Of course Boeing won after having lost the initial bid; we have a union-supported communist government in Washington reinforced by the Chicago mafia.

  • Jack

    @ Grendel – Both companies got the other’s figures by mistake. Boeing’s handling of the issue was much, much better than EADS’. As soon as the Boeing people realized what they had, the material was sealed in a safe for several reasons: 1. To prevent those who had seen it to see more than they had, and 2. To prevent the information from being spread. In light of the ethics issues surrounding the first go-round of the tanker deal, Boeing has adopted a very strict code of ethics, to the point that just about ANY ethical violation is grounds for immediate termination and possible legal action. By contrast, EADS probably spread the Boeing information around with bottles of champagne.

  • Jack

    Last I checked, Boeing Corporate wasn’t union.

  • Justin

    You noticed that Northrop grumman didn’t bid again with EADS. It’s because they new it was fixed. They already won the contract fair and square. They weren’t about to get their teeth kicked in again by the government.

    Northrop and EADS also had a working aircraft, while Boeing just had drawings.

  • Warcraft Donoso

    The EADs plane weighs 275,000 and the BOEING plane weighs 180.000 pounds. Both bids were within a dollar of the other. How could the bid be so close if EADs was not subsidized by the Europeans governments? Moreover, EADs was the wider and bigger plane on same size runways and buildings…all of which would have to be rebuilt adding tremendously to costs, obviously. Bribes would be so large, too.

  • Joel D. Leek

    Kenya was British Colony when Obama was born there.

  • Bill

    What most are overlooking is that this was a PRICE based competition. USAF probably did this because an award on price doesn’t give much grounds for a protest.

    There were certain minimum criteria that had to be met which both a/c did. Unless the bids and total life cost were within 1% of each other, no credit would be given for exceeding the requirements. If they were, 96 other factors would then be considered and USAF would then “adjust” the bid prices for the purposes of calculating the winner. Boeing’s bid was More than 1% less that EADS’. Therefore, the other factors don’t come into play, and they awarded strictly on price.

    Keep something else in mind. The EADS plane was larger than the KC-10 (USAF’s big tanker), but didn’t carry as much fuel to give to other aircraft. If a smaller airplane can meet the refueling requirement, that means you can park more on an airbase ramp of given size. More importantly, with a cheaper plane burning less fuel, you can have more of them in the air at a given time. The more tankers you can have in the air for a given amount of fuel, the more aircraft you can refuel at a given time.=, and that’s what this competition was for:: a refueling tanker. The larger plane may have more fuel to offload, but like the smaller one, it can only refuel one USAF (or two USN) aircraft at a time. So, the more tankers you can get up there at a given time, the more planes you can refuel faster.

    But still, the bottom line was that this award was based on price, and it looks like Boeing’s was lower.

  • Scottsdale Boy

    I think we have to applaud the decision to award this contact to Boeing. In addition to the obvious benefit of creating employment in the U.S., the decision protects the United States against any possible adverse political decisions the principal shareholde­rs (i.e., France, Germany) of Airbus could make over the 50+ years lifespan of this contact. Had the contract been granted to Airbus, no one today can guarantee that in the next 50 years its owners would not exert political influence re delivery, maintenanc­e, parts etc. contrary to our national interest.

    As to Senator Shelby and his disgracefu­l behavior, I wouldn’t mind if Congress permitted the Alabama National Guard to acquire 100 staff cars from Volkwagen. A small mind at least deserves a small contract.

  • Opaobie

    Northrop and EADS don’t have a working aircraft, their boom fell off during a flight test, while Boeing has been delivering aerial refueling aircraft for more than half a century. The Japanese and Italian Air Forces are flying the KC-767 tanker TODAY. How many countries fly Airbus tankers? Even the FRENCH fly KC-135s..

  • jess

    There is another way to win contracts besides bribing??

  • Northrop Grumman employee

    Why do media channels so happily call Boeing’s competitor as EADS and therefore a foreign entity? Northrop Grumman employees identify themselves as having had the competing contract, that originally won. Why isn’t Boeing referred to by its non-US partners? There’s Chicago style politics and total lying and deceipt infolved here. Shame on Boeing for being so smug about this. Shame on the Obama regime and its favorites.

  • Opaobie

    EADS builds the airplane, not Northrop Grumman. I’m sure Northrup Grumman is a fine company, but what contribution would they actually make to the finished AIRBUS product? Boeing builds both the airplane AND the aerial refueling system and has been doing so for more than half a century. Boeing created the aerial refueling technology. The offer submitted by EADS/Northrup Grumman did NOT adhere to the specifications. Boeing’s offer DID adhere to the specifications, and the GAO agreed. That is why the Boeing protest prevailed and why Boeing has finally been awarded the contract after a year of useless delay. EADS is a European Union subsidized conglomerate. Boeing is a publicly traded U.S. company. Only Boeing’s headquarters are located in Chicago, and for most of its existence, its headquarters were in Seattle…until taxes and other costs imposed by Liberal Democrats drove them out of the state. This competition has been going on for about a decade, so claiming that Chicago politics or some last minute intervention by Obama caused the awarding of the contract to Boeing is absurd. If EADS/Airbus/Northrop Grumman-financed John McCain had stayed out of the process, New Generation Tankers would already be rolling off the Boeing assembly line, and the warfighters would already have their new superior tanker.

  • AP

    Yeara ago, I was an airline top-level executive who was responsible for the purchase, building and delivery of aircraft for our airline fleet. Traditionally, we bought Douglas aircraft until the merger, then we were forced to buy Boeing.

    Most of us genuinely loved Douglas as their people were the finest and in my opinion, the best aircraft money could buy. Despite the drawbacks of their assembly line progress, overall, they consistently produced an excellent product much better than Boeing, and certainly better than Airbus. As an aircraft buyer, I would always pick Boeing over Airbus anyday. Why? In my opinion, buying Airbus is buying planned obsolescence. Once the electronic flight control system and associated avionics go sour, then the whole thing becomes a gigantic club house! It can’t be flown!

    The old Douglas DC3 and8s and Boeing aircraft are still flying! Look at the KC-135, over 50 years old! How about the B-52? We had great engineers and technicians who were way ahead of their time in that the overall production philosophy was different. They made things less complex. A skilled mechanic with a box of tools could fix almost everything in these aircraft to keep them flying. For Aiirbus, the numerous computers and electronic systems seem to make the whole airframe far less reliable over time. The aircraft depends too much on electronics and not on good old fashioned systems that have withstood the test of time.

    I cannot envision any Airbus product, except the A300B, being able to function in a nuclear weapon environment. The EMP effects might well wreck all the electronics on board instantly. A nearby A-blast could render an Airbus fleet incapable of flight forever! I see no reason why the American military should take any chance of problems by buying foreign designed and manufactured aircraft. The new Boeing tanker will have lots of foreign content in it already, just as its commercial jet program has now. The difference is that the plane will be designed, built for and by Americans. That’s the way all military and government programs should be operated.

    Even Mr. O’s 747-200s use older analog technology for flight instrumentation. It is much more survivable in a nuclear conflict than sensitive digital circuit technology.

    Personally, I wish we would begin to cut back significantly on our military and other expenditures. We simply can’t afford it anymore and there must be an adjustment to government procurement and thinking if the system is to survive intact.

    Purchase fewer tankers and keep the assembly tooling and knowledge base in place in the event we need to make more. Let’s not build any more than is necessary.

    Again, I’m glad for Boeing that this is finally sorted out. I don’t want our soldiers, sailors and airment relying upon foreign nations for their vital equipment needs. Without question, regardless of cost, I want all our military to be equipped with American products and services.

  • LizardLips

    Hmm, let’s see. What does Obama, Rahm, Daley and Boeing have in common? Chicago. Curious, no?

  • DirtyPolitics

    Other than currently being a Boeing employee, having seen the summary 767 vs. A330 technical and flight capabilities, having climbed in/under/around both planes in detail in hangers and on flight lines. Your right … I wouldn’t know./sarc/
    The last 767 order was in 1996 and 15 years later they are still rolling them out (behind schedule)!?! Their 787, 747-8 programs are well behind schedule and over budget!?! You tell me why they got the contract.

  • DirtyPolitics

    You are correct. I will try to be perfect like you next time. =)

  • 00Billy

    Heheh, Australia and Italy have used the Airbus version for 5 years now?

    Americans have wasted a lot of time.

  • Turkeybird

    Looks like three times is a charm! How quick will Boeing come back for more dollars and extensions on delivery dates after this fiasco?

    The true fact however is that if the original contract had gone through with Boeing over a decade ago we would have planes in the air already at half the cost!

  • toolboy

    We ALL need to buy American, boycott foreign goods. Tanya Sinkovits
    sounds un American and subscribes to corrupt Chicagoland dirty politics.

  • M.L. Bushman

    One other important fact that’s being overlooked–Boeing created refueling in the air technology. EADs was trying to push their airplane off on us without ever having successfully refueled another airplane in flight. Are we just supposed to take their word for it? Are we supposed to gamble the lives our US fliers to discover they couldn’t make good on their “word”?

    I guess if you were the parent of an Air Force flier or the relative of one, you might want the US government to choose to keep US dollars in the States by going with the more experienced firm.

    The original contract specs were changed so many times during the original bidding process, not to favor Boeing, but EADs, a European Company. The contract was intended to be used as another way to ship US funds and jobs out of our country to further weaken our economy.

    And please tell me what sense it makes to have a foreign company build a plane that might be used in war someday–there’s always the problem of parts, isn’t there? Would it be better to get the parts from a US manufacturer and supplier headquartered on US soil or would it be better to have them backordered by a French firm?

    Union or not, I’m glad Boeing won. Let EADs bellyache right up until 2012. That’s when real hope and change begins–once the Organizer in Chief, the closet Muslim, has vacated the White House and taken his whole host of global socialists and RINOs with him.

  • catherwood

    Call it dirty politics, call it Chicago politics, call it Obama politcs. Of course it’s dirty politics. What you need to realize is that this is all perfectly normal for our manboy, inexperienced, ineffective quasi president. A place as far south and west as St. Louis has no place in his thinking; you’re just out there clinging to your religion and guns. You are not relevant to the Chosen One.

  • William

    @chukalukabus
    You say “The ONLY difference between between the two companys is that Boeing is 100% union labor. EADS, not so much.”

    Are you daft? Boeing may be heavily unionized, but they don’t build planes down to the bolt and rivet – they depend on many SMEs to build the parts that go into the planes. Duh.

    And so you think Europe isn’t heavily unionized? Do you even live on EARTH? “EADS, not so much.” Incredible. Furnish the data you so carefully scoured before posting this rubbish.

  • RetAF

    Opaobie,

    True, technically speaking the “flying boom” goes back to the B29 days. But the latest boom technology was developed by Douglas for the KC10, BEFORE they were bought out by Boeing.

    I have some knowledge and expertise in this area as I flew tankers in the Air Force. 14 years in the KC135 and 14 in the KC10.

    Biggest mistake made was NOT to continue production of the KC10 past 60. (59 still flying)

  • Paul Scipio

    Boeing should have had this contract from the vary beginning, enough of contracting out to foreign companies for our major defense work. The 767 is plenty capable in handling the tanker job plus the work, business and profits are made in this country. If this was dirty Chicago politics well I guess this is the VARY FIRST TIME I ever agreed with that imbecile street organizer on anything, I’m just glad it not calling for lightning storms today where I live otherwise I would be in the house all day.

  • Andrew

    It’s not a huge stretch to see San Francisco in the biblical light of “Sodom”. With that, there must be a “Gomorrah”. It’s not hard for me to see that being a toss-up between New York City and Chicago.

    Chicago has been corrupt since . . . well, how long can we remember? Simply a bevy of criminals starting with the highest office in the land to the common mobster. So what is the point of publishing an article or two about the subject if the people of “Gomorrah” themselves don’t take action to change their city’s nature?

    It boils down to a city of people with NO PLUCK.

  • rj

    How about the government disclosing the comments from the source selection? Maybe they can offer a public award debriefing publically on a contract of this size. How was risk and performace rated? Was best value low bid? Youcan bet the government will hide all information even if you FOIA it.

  • jaom651946

    I SWEAR!!! I read someone post this headline in a comment to the article where as at the time the contract was awarded!!! That guy should be president? He understands and knows the future? Unlike what we have in office NOW!!???

  • Mark

    Do you know what the comments would have been like if Boeing didn’t win this thing? You would have been bashing Obama and saying “See, he is a socialist!, See! He hates America!” You don’t think St. Louis is represented here? Are you kidding? While everyone was getting laid off, my brother continued and continues his job at a small local business that exists and profits only because of the work they do for Boeing and LM. And, NO, they are not union. There are a bunch of little shops like that, look at their vendor list. This is good for small business and non-union shops and it’s good for Unions and it’s good for America period and if you can’t see that, you are so wrapped up in your hate that it’s blinding you.

  • Czechbikr

    While I believe that Boeing makes a superior airplane, there is a lot at work here that suggests that there are other reasons why they “won” the contract.
    1) The Boeing protest was upheld in 2008, an election year.
    2)The bids were “accidentally” released? Did Julian Assange work for the DOD?
    3)Boeing is a union concern. Alabama is a right to work state. Bottom line, after Obama was elected, EADS might just as well saved their money pursuing the bid. NOW, look for the unions to agitate to rework their contracts. Also, in two years and 10 billions dollars, look for Boeing to say that they made a “mistake” and cannot produce the planes for the original price and for our federal government (you the tax slave) to have to pay them more for each unit because we are tied into the design, training and stores. It truly is…BUSINESS AS USUAL. REMEMBER IN 2012 people, and finish the job started in 2010.

  • Red

    You can bet that Boeing will come in later in the contract and ask for more money due to cost over runs, etc. The EADS bid was to use an existing aircraft, not build/modify some other design, and would have been more cost effective. This should have never happened and can only be thought of as “Chicago politics as usual” and where is our President from?

  • JimmyD

    Bottom line, would you rather have 1500 jobs in Mobile, AL or 50,000 jobs throughout 40 states. It’s not rocket science.

  • Jody

    Another question is ,will they use the new and old fleet for the chemtrail/weather modification program? That is more scandalous than the crooked contract. Mayor Daley brought Boeing HQ to town through tax breaks which became the burden of citizens. Not much is not corrupt in Chicago.

  • Jno

    Congratulations to POTUS and his union friends. They FINALLY got things rigged so that Boeing, with it hidden subsidies from taxpayers, was the only one that could bid successfully. No allowance in price was made for getting a larger, more efficient aircraft that could carry much more fuel. Way to go POTUS! You have rewarded you union backers and their thugs handsomely! Now on th Wisconsiin and try to help the unions overrule the will of the voters. This from a life-long CONSERVATIVE Democrat who, in his well over 80 years has never spent more than he made.

  • B

    Boeing accused of cheating? That’s never happened before (what font should I use for sarcasm).

  • John

    They’ve held this bidding process over and aover and over until finally Boeing won. Boeing’s original proposal was much much more expensive.

    But now that they have it locked up, we can expect astronomical “cost over runs” in 3… 2…. 1….

    The military procurement process in this country is an outrage.

  • RufusVonDufus

    Come on, people, you know that EVERYTHING is political, even which vegetables Mrs. Greenjeans Obama is going to grow in her garden this spring. You all make me laugh!

  • RufusVonDufus

    Hoos cares?

  • John

    The military procurement process is not a jobs program. Our nation, our fighting men and women, depend on getting the best hardward at the lowest price.

    In China, do you think they are building their military in terms of who gets what jobs? Or do you think they are just building the best weapons they can?

  • RufusVonDufus

    Politics and politicians every are corrupt. It is the nature of the beast. If politicians are not corrupt they are not trying. To the victor go the spoils, but only if the victor is a communit- organizing liberal Dem from Chicago!

  • joeyusa

    IT’s EASY BUY AMERICAN- as we all should–

  • Jeff

    DUH! Of course it’s drty politics! Is anything in Chicago clean?

  • Another Northrop employee

    Northrop Grumman was the prime contractor that won the bid in Feb. 2009. That bid was from Northrop Grumman, not EADS. EADS was a subcontractor that supplied the aircraft, which was to be assembled in a new plant in Alabama. The military systems, including the refueling system were going to built by Northrop.

    When the 2009 award was overturned it became obvious that any bid that did not include Boeing was going to be rejected by any means necessary, which is why Northrop withdrew from the competition. No point in spending money to pursue a contract that was already preordained to go to the competition.

  • B

    to Joeyusa…they are both. Both would be assembled in the USA. Boeing just makes you think they wont be.

  • SourPuss

    Ralph, Boeing had originally won a contract to have their airplanes leased from them. Then the government decided to put it out to bid to purchase them instead. EADS, or NG, submitted a bid for an aircraft that vastly exceeded what was asked for in the bid. Because of this Boeing said that the extras were not called out for in the original RFP, and wanted another try at it. This time though, holding both parties to what was asked for in the RFP.
    Boeing won because their aircraft can utilize ALL the existing landing strips that the current tankers (KC135′s) can use. The EADS aircraft was too large to land on most of them. That, accompanied by the fact that the Boeing aircraft burns 1 TON less fuel per hour than the EADS aircraft, thus giving billions in savings over the lifespan of the aircraft. So why would we pick EADS / NG?

  • http://yesbuthowever.com/boeing%e2%80%99s-contract-win-dirty-politics/ Boeing’s Contract Win Dirty Politics? | Yes, But, However!

    [...] some analysts can’t help but question, why Boeing? The long thought underdog took the $35 billion deal Thursday from previous contract winner European Aeronautic Defence.Related posts:Boeing Puts [...]

  • astralweeks

    “Should be “its”, not “it’s”.” is not a sentence. It should be “It “Should be “its”, not “it’s.” Also the comma and period should fall inside the parenthesis. See, I can point out you’re a doofus, too.

  • astralweeks

    Yep

  • astralweeks

    Too true, Gendel. Obama doesn’t think Alabama is one of the “57 states.”

  • SourPuss

    Identon, NO, Boeing has 65% of PARTS fabricated overseas, but 100% of the aircraft are assembled in America. From what I hear only the final assembly would have been done in America on the EADS aircraft.

  • astralweeks

    Really? Wish he had run for prime minister, then.

  • John Richard Walsh

    EADS was a better plane and larger also so of course Obama politics decided a national security decision to the detriment of the USAF> Russian Academy of Sciences revealed they had trained Obama to be a communist and atheist so he is destroying America financially and militarily thanks to the useful idiots in Washington D.C.

  • SourPuss

    Italics works pretty good.

  • Pete

    where are we getting the $35 billion from? Not sure why this is needed or how it keeps us safer.

  • southe

    I am o.k. with the fact that a U.S. contractor wins for a major U.S. government job. Doesn’t make sense to give this to foreign business unless we lacked the capability.

  • MacDaddyWatch

    Big win for the MacDaddy.

    This will be the only jobs he created since being installed into the Oval Office.

  • Opaobie

    “Also the comma and period should fall inside the parenthesis. See, I can point out you’re a doofus, too.”

    ….Astralweeks, did you mean to say “parenthesis” or “closing quotes” in your critique? When correcting someone else’s error, you might want to make sure you don’t make an error yourself…although this all has nothing to do with the topic being discussed. :) .

  • Opaobie

    Heheh, 5 whole years!! Impressive!!! ….and the rest of the world has been flying Boeing tankers for more than 50 years, and the French are flying KC-135s, and other NATO countries, are too, and the Italians and the Japanese are, too, along with KC-767s, and the Dutch fly KC-10s, and….5 years, huh? Wow!!!….any of Australia’s or Italy’s Airbus booms fall off like the new Airbus flight test tanker’s did?

  • WILLIE

    OF COURSE STREET THUG OBAMA SAW THAT THE TANKER CONTRACT WENT TO BOENG. HE COULD NOT LET MONEY AND JOBS GO TO A RIGHT TO WORK(NON-UNION) RED STATE LIKE ALABAMA. HE OWES TOO MUCH TO HIS UNION FRIENDS. NOW THE PLANE WILL TAKE TWICE AS LONG TO PRODUCE, COST THREE TIMES AS MUCH AND END UP BEING SUBCONTRACTED TO CHINA.

  • Opaobie

    RetAF, without going into all the details, the boom on the KC-10 is not the same as the boom on the KC-135 or the one on the GTTA 767 tanker and is not the one that will be installed on the new Air Force tanker…I have also flown KC-135s along with a number of other military and civilian aircraft. I agree that they should not have stopped rolling out KC-10s, though.

  • Opaobie

    The bid submitted by NG/EADS/???? and whoever else you want to include DID NOT MEET THE SPEC. It was a “Christmas Tree”. It was rejected because of that, and the GAO agreed. Who really believes EADS would ship parts of an airplane to a yet-to-be-built plant in Alabama to be put together along with a yet-to-be-perfected air refueling system…all with only 1500 new-hire American workers? And THAT is supposed to be preferred to building the entire aircraft inline on a highly experienced, integrated Boeing assembly line complete with provisions for the air refueling system BUILT-IN so that final modifications could be done along with flight testing and delivery from an EXISTING, WORLD CLASS BOEING facility in the Right-to-work state of Kansas? Thousands of American suppliers and subcontractors all over the country will benefit from the Boeing work, and the Air Force will FINALLY get the tanker they requested TEN YEARS AGO. No wonder Boeing’s proposal won.

  • RufusVonDufus

    None of it will do Obama any good in ’12 as long as we all remember how he supported the unions and Chicago only in ’11.

  • Curt

    Enough already. Back and forth, back and forth this contract goes.

  • Joe Bandmember

    Dirty politics would be if the Chicagoland gangsters in the White House let a foreign company build the tankers.

  • Dollarshort

    Politics – dirty, is there any other kind?
    Politics is a full contact sport or a blood sport for the untrained or unsophisticated in the sport.

  • Patriot

    EADS Supporters,
    I would like to make this selection process simple and explain to you the most critical issue, although there are other issues. I was a USAF operations planner and live in the South….also a Republican, but Patriot first! I would like you to just take for one moment and understand this tanker issue. Boeing, or EADS, whoever makes the tanker is not the issue, the issue is the number of refueling booms in the air for a strike package or airlift deployment that is the key and always will be. In 1996 I planned President Clinton’s visit to Asia. Due to the large airlift requirement, I had to deploy 3 KC-135s to Pago Pago due to the large number of airlifters passing through to Australia. The EADS Tanker could barely fit on the tarmac there if it was in service today. Also, the EADS tanker could not be in three different refueling rendezvous times at once. With a total of 245, 00 lbs of fuel capacity (KC-10 350,000lbs) and that includes fuel for him to return to base, he would be fuel offload limited. Now we could send three more EADS tankers down to Pago Pago, but only one can land there, so you have burn up tons of fuel and more assets then really required whereby you send three 767 tankers at around 202,000 pound of fuel per plane and you have a offload capacity of around 420,000 lbs of fuel versus the EADS offload of 200,000lbs……does the light bulb come on? Do you see that it is more than a European or American thing, it is called force projection and if we mix our tanker fleet with all large aircraft………you have limited your force projection because you limit the number of aircraft you can forward deploy due to ramp space. This FACT IS NOT ABOUT POLITICS, it is about military planning. As far as Senator Shelby who I previously thought was OK, well it seems that he would have sacrificed the better benefit to America and the military for 1500, count them, 1500 jobs to be re-elected and he usually has no problem getting elected. His ignorance in blaming politics versus what the USAF needs and requires is the OLD PORK BARRELL POLITICS, both sides are guilty off.

  • sean

    let american companies build our planes its as simple as that.

  • redhawkone

    Chicago Polotics?? NAHH
    Boeing+ based in Chicago with production in WA oh wait both DIMIC RAT States…
    Engines made by P&W in Connecticutt.. another Dimi C rat State…Rats in Washington Politics .. wait YES that is the answer!!!

  • Jim Goff

    I would suggest that this person from Chicago would rather see the jobs move to France.

  • http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/omni-pr/1188825-boeing-wins-help-chicago-machine.html#post15942741 Boeing wins with help from Chicago Machine – FlyerTalk Forums

    [...] [...]

  • Leroy

    Just surprising that the engine part of the deal didn’t get switched to GE…

  • Opaobie

    …and the final modification, testing, and delivery completed with at least 7,500 AMERICAN jobs in KANSAS alone …a “Right-To-Work” state that just swept Democrats out and is solidly Republican….NAHH, just good business.

  • Dread

    when were we obligated to bail out General Motors or wall street? and explain the constitutionality of “too big to fail”.

  • smokehouse56

    Sorry sean, it’s not as simple as that.

  • MarkD

    Patriot, thanks much for such a clear and lucid explanation. I’ve always wondered what were the real issues, and I get it now.

    As far as the nationality in manufacturing is concerned, where a plane is assembled, or it’s parts manufactured doesn’t matter as much as where it is designed. What our relationship to Europe will be like in 50 years is anyone’s guess. I’m relieved that Boeing got the contract for the technical and political reasons. In the end, the bidding process didn’t serve us well. However flawed the leased arrangement was that John McCain torpedoed, he should not have stood in the way of getting the right plane to replace an aging fleet at the time and the way he did. Burnished his credentials, but the military had to fly aging planes another decade, and it almost went horribly wrong.

  • MarkD

    Hey check out what the wikipedia page on the KC-10 says:

    “The 1973 Yom Kippur War and the US Operation Nickel Grass demonstrated the necessity of adequate air-refueling capabilities. Denied landing rights in Europe, USAF C-5 Galaxies were forced to carry a fraction of their maximum payload on direct flights from the continental United States to Israel. As a result C-5 crews were soon trained in aerial refueling and the U.S. Department of Defense concluded that a more advanced tanker was needed.”

    With our history with Europeans and war, it is amazing that EADs was ever considered at all. They should have simply been reminded of their past petulance and been told to pound sand.

  • Opaobie

    Dread, your point is well taken. Since the government has become unhinged from the Constitution and is imposing a soft tyranny on the nation, anything can happen, but Boeing isn’t the bankrupt General Motors, and we have another opportunity to continue “cleaning house” and restoring the rule of law in 2012.

  • Cowboy

    Happy that the contract went to the US.company

    Disappointed that the decision was based on politics instead of merit.

  • Cowboy

    So, where do you live in Chicago?

  • Leroy

    The only non-government jobs

  • Cowboy

    Pete… Gotta keep the unions working somehow…

  • Cowboy

    Jack, but its manufacturing facilities are.

  • Cowboy

    The Air Force doesn’t accommodate the C-5 Galaxy now?

  • Opaobie

    Cowboy, don’t be disappointed, it WAS based on merit. I suggest you read some of the more lucid and accurate posts on this page (and do some research outside this article) and if you still don’t understand why Boeing was the clear winner, you just aren’t paying attention. :)

  • big time liberal

    im utterly SHOCKED CHUKALUKABUS SHOCKED that you would even hint that there was scandal involved.do you really believe the unions could possibly be crooked. im sure obama voiced concern about this like he did the wisconsin fight to get rid of worthless unions.one thing for sure you can bet on. there will be know more corruption in chicago land now that raums in charge.

  • chow

    The Chinese are not buying foreign made military hardware so it’s not a comparison. As for best hardware at the lowest price, it seems Boeing won at that. When you said it’s not about job…perhaps in the past but nowadays with high unemployment and everything are outsourced, it’s great that an America based company got the contract.

  • chow

    Here, here!!!

  • Mike

    Pete – currently the United State is flying a fleet of about 190 KC-135, originally built in the 1950s and 1960 using the Boeing 707 airframe and about 60 larger KC-10s based on the DC-10 airframe. While these planes do not need to be replaced immediately, there is need to replace KC-135s at least over the next two decades.

    There are only several large jets suitable for tanker use based on load capacity compared to overall airplane weight. You can look all of this up. Unless you oppose the United States having a large military or you are convinced that the United States and our allies will faced sharply reduced dangers worldwide in the future, you have to support beginning to replace this aged tanker fleet.

  • Bill Kimbrough

    Good news for the US. About time we take care of our own industrial base. Dirty pool, I don’ care. Creates jobs, good jobs, and keeps our technology base keen and up to date. This is great news for all and a boost for Boeing. Congratulations.

  • Keister7

    Dirty politics? of course it was

  • Keister7

    is there any other kind?

  • gteg

    hes Ass hole

  • Scott

    first of all, the award is only for 18 aircraft to be delivered for eval by 2017. Boeing purposely underbid simply to win. Now they have to deliver. How many have forgotten that Boeing would have had a tanker contract in 2003 if they were not caught bid rigging and ripping off the taxpayers! Hmmm…how many Boeing execs went to federal prison?

  • Opaobie

    Apples and oranges, Cowboy. The mission and basing for the C-5, as well as for the C-17, are completely different from the mission and basing requirenemts of aerial refueling tankers. You might as well make a comparison between fighters and bombers. They and their missions and basing needs aren’t interchangeable, either, but that doesn’t mean both aren’t needed to fill their different roles.

  • http://botd.wordpress.com/2011/02/28/top-posts-1765/ Top Posts — WordPress.com

    [...] Boeing’s Contract Win Dirty Politics? ST. LOUIS, Mo. (KMOX) — Boeing workers across the United States are celebrating their big win today, but some analysts [...] [...]

  • Opaobie

    Scott, if you’re going to slander a company, at least get the slander correct. The Boeing bid would have won hands down if former United States Air Force civilian official (Principal Deputy Undersecretary of the Air Force for Acquisition) Darleen Druyun and former Boeing CFO Mike Sears hadn’t interfered unnecessarily. The lease idea was not the best way to go, buying the aircraft was a much better option, Boeing’s offer was the right aircraft, but with the scandal topping things off, the Air Force and DoD went back to the drawing board, as well they should have. They have now come full circle; back to the correct choice.

    In October 2004, Druyun was sentenced to nine months in jail for corruption, fined $5,000, given three years of supervised release and 150 hours of community service. Sears was fired from Boeing, and Boeing CEO Phil Condit resigned, although he had nothing to do with it; Harry Stonecipher was Sears’ mentor and the man who promoted him to CFO after the Boeing/McDonnell Douglas merger.. On February 18, 2005, Sears was sentenced to four months in prison. Boeing ended up paying a $615 million fine for their involvement. Boeing instituted the most stringent ethics and procurement conformance program in the industry following this fiasco, and it is monitored by the government.

    Now, would you like to take a look at EADS’ record of embarrassments, or do you just hate AMERICAN companies?

  • Cowboy

    Partially correct. The geography and logistics significantly overlap. And many airbases in hot areas are built to accommodate something that can handle ‘large vehicles’ as cargo.

    Been there, done that.

  • Cowboy

    Been paying significant attention for a long time.
    Just not buying the politics.

  • CK

    Pete, It’s needed because the current tankers are long overdue for replacement. They have reached their life span in flight hours. The funding is another story?

  • CK

    Scott, I didn’t know that you have seen the bids. How did you get access to them so quickly? Or are you making up this info? Come clean Scott.

  • 126

    does this tanker come with a tool kit of wrenches 1/4 to 1 inch that will cost extra and not in the contract to the tune of $10,000 each like so many government contract have so the manufacture can make a profit. Nothing like hidden cost not in a contract.

  • Opaobie

    126, blame government regulations, not the supplier, for the outrageous cost of items purchased to meet their “specifications”. This is one of the reasons why the USA ranks so far behind other countries in “business-friendliness” and why American companies have been forced to move many of their operations off shore to survive, along with the onerous taxes. Wait till the EPA and the other alphabet soup agencies REALLY kick in the regulations to comply with “Cap and Trade”.

  • Opaobie

    Out of a $1.5 TRILLION budget, maybe they could find it by eliminating Vice President Joe Biden’s $53 billion to be wasted on passenger trains and high-speed rail projects (like the absurd route from Orlando to Miami) over the next six years as part of the administration’s goal of making high-speed rail accessible to 80 percent of Americans (who don’t want it and won’t use it) within 25 years (not even in a million years).

  • Keister7

    The liberal democrats did drive Boeing out and the unions drove Boeing to start a new plant across the country. It is just a matter of time till Boeing shifts the najority of their assembly plants in the southeastern part of America, where people actually want to work!

    Translation… The overwhelming part of this contract will not be filled in Seattle!

  • http://blog.icuonlineweb.tv/2011/02/28/boeing-lands-pentagon-contract/ Boeing Lands Pentagon Contract | ICU Online Blog Central

    [...] Bloomberg’s chief Washington correspondent tells KMOX radio station in St. Louis- the contract win for Boeing came as a surprise even to seasoned financial analysts like [...]

  • Big Al

    Interesting how this ar\ticles leaves out the glaring reason why Boeing won (that most other articles/news outlets have reported.) It was simple, If you take in account that the Boeing 767 fuel cost is ~$1500 / hour vs the EADS A330 fuel cost is ~$1900/hour, then multiply that by 179 tankers, then multiple that by 40 years of fly time and then factor in the fact the aviation fuel will absolutely increase over the next 40 yerars, then the numbers are quite simple. The Boeing 767 will save the American taxpayer billions of dollars over its lifespan. A fact that is this article is sadly missing.

  • Proud American

    I dont believe airbus is made by northrup now is it? Why support the French? What have they ever done for us? They know nothing about military and defense, aside from run in the opposite direction. Keep american military planes built in america. Where is there an airbus factory in the US? Open your eyes.

  • Another Northrop Employee

    Wow Proud American, ignorant, protectionist and racist is no way to go through life. EADS was a subcontractor to Northrop for the bid won by Northrop. Northrop was the prime contractor. Such distinctions matter.

  • Judy G

    EADS/Airbus is already more than 14 YEARS behind their delivery schedule on a constract. How do you figure that they can keep to a schedule better than Boeing? They have the same union and supplier problems in their facilities that we have here.

  • Personalised Mothersday Gifts

    I�m impressed, I must say. Seldom do I encounter a blog that�s both equally educative and amusing, and let me tell you, you have hit the nail on the head. The issue is something which too few folks are speaking intelligently about. I’m very happy that I found this during my search for something concerning this.

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